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瑞典记者 Khazar Fatemi:仍在寻找遗落于阿富汗的过往

「心之所向」 截图(由 Khazar Fatemi 上传至 Vimeo 的版本)

乍看之下,瑞典主要电视台的记者 Khazar Fatemi 是个既聪颖又美丽、无忧无虑的人。但他在阿富汗所拍摄的纪录片「心之所向」,充分展现了他承自于父母的那股牺牲小我与奋斗不懈的精神。

Fatemi 出生于1983 年;八岁的时候,他(当初曾参与过伊朗库德族(Kurdish)反抗运动)的双亲[为了]逃离日益频繁的暴力冲突,举家自他们的第二故乡阿富汗搬到瑞典。

当时,圣战士(mujaheddin)已经击退苏联的入侵,却陷入了内斗的漩涡之中。年纪稍长,Fatemi 对儿时住过的阿富汗首都喀布尔(Kabul)泛起了深深的思念之情,也涌起一股内疚感,因为──和他的朋友们不同──他成功逃离了阿富汗的血腥内战。

心之所向」在泪水与笑声中,讲述了 Fatemi 的返乡之旅──只不过,喀布尔已然人事全非。在阿姆斯特丹国际纪录片影展(IDFA)与雨舞影展(Raindance Film Festival)等国际影展放映过后,本片以其真诚,赢得不少掌声。

他的旅程,是一位记者的旅程──为了亲眼目睹阿富汗今日光景,也是一个人的旅程──为了寻访童年故旧。然而,他心心念念的挚友,却杳然无踪。他一直没查出,这位朋友后来怎么了。

全球之声最近与Fatemi 碰面,和他进行了一番谈话──从生于穆斯林多数之国家的人在欧洲生活所遭遇的困难、他的童年,到阿富汗动荡的过往与现状,无一不谈。

Nevena Borisova(NB):身为一位深受极度传统社会影响的现代女性,是什么感觉?

Khazar Fatemi (KF): The reason my family fled Iran during the 1980s was that they wanted to keep the freedom their parents have given to them, despite their own religious background […] My grandparents were Muslims but still believed that everyone has the right to make their own choice of life and beliefs. So, for me it is important to use the freedom my parents fought so hard for, including [their struggle] against the regime, which left them with no choice but to leave their home. For 35 years they have not been able to go back.

The biggest challenge for me is not that I am coming from a traditional society. For me it has been Swedish society, which keeps questioning me because of my foreign name the way I look. I have had to work ten times harder to prove myself, despite the fact that I know Swedish perfectly. God knows what my mom has gone through because of her accent.

Khazar Fatemi(KF):我的家人之所以在1980 年代逃离伊朗,就是为了想保住他们的父母亲在自己的宗教背景之下,仍赋予他们的自由[⋯⋯]我的祖父母是穆斯林,但仍相信每个人都有权利去选择自己的生活与信仰。所以,对我来说,善用我父母千辛万苦──包括对抗政府──所挣来的自由,是很重要的。 [对抗政府]让他们别无选择,只能离乡背井。三十五年了,他们都还没能回去。

对我而言,最大的挑战不是出身于传统的社会;我最大的挑战是:瑞典社会因为我的名字、样貌和一般瑞典人不同,而不断地质疑我。我一直都得比别人努力十倍来证明自己,尽管我的瑞典文一点问题也没有──天知道我妈妈因为他的口音,都经历了些什么。

「心之所向」 截图(由 Khazar Fatemi 上传至 Vimeo 的版本)

NB:你在纪录片中解释过,当你的团队在喀布尔四处游历的时候,那里有常态性的安全措施、炸弹检查之类的。你如何处理那种恐惧感?

The fear is always there, but one still can travel under control. I have tried my best to work with people that have the knowledge of security but they also know the local society, culture, tradition and religion. We tried not to leave the car unwatched and we also tried as often as we could to travel low key profile. We did not stay too long and we even changed our car from day to day when it was possible. At the same time, no one has ever taken so much care of me [as my team]. Even when I got sick, they treated me so well. I'm their guest, they kept saying.

KF:那种恐惧是一直都在,但你还是能正常旅行。我尽量和了解安全措施,也了解当地社会、文化、传统与宗教的人合作。我们试着不要让车子离开我们的视线;旅途中,我们也试着尽可能保持低调。我们不待太久,可能的话,我们甚至每天换车。但是,从来没有人[像我的团队]那样照顾我;即使在我生病的时候,他们也对我很好。他们一直说,我是他们的宾客。

NB:这部纪录片拍摄的方式,让人感觉它很真诚,捕捉到所有情绪。能不能告诉我们,你是怎么想到要拍摄这部纪录片,又是怎么着手进行的?

KF: When you make a documentary, you know what you want. However, we never had a script, so we just let the camera roll and hoped for the best. I kept asking myself what had happened to those who didn't have the chance to flee when the war came. I wondered what had happened to my best friend Marim, to my teachers, to the baker in the neighborhood. So, I had all these questions that I needed to find answers to. Maybe I wanted to ease my own guilt which kept growing the older I got. I had always known I would go back at any chance, so why not document it? So I talked to my media outlet and asked if I could borrow technical equipment.

I have learned that if you just listen to what people say, you will understand that they have amazing, heartbreaking, but inspiring and empowering stories to tell.

KF:拍纪录片的时候,你知道自己要的是什么。但我们从来就没有脚本,所以我们只是让摄影机一直拍,然后希望能呈现出最好的结果。我一直问自己,战争爆发的时候,那些没机会逃离的人怎么了。我想知道,我最好的朋友 Marim、我的老师们,还有附近的面包师傅怎么了。所以,我有一大堆问题,却没有答案。也许我是想要抚平自己与日俱增的罪恶感。我一直都知道,只要一有机会我就会回去,那么为什么不把它记录下来呢?所以我去和电视台谈,问他们我是不是可以借用器材。

我学到,只要你好好听别人讲话,就会知道,他们有许多很棒的、令人心碎却又鼓舞人心、能让人从中得到力量的故事可说。

NB:从纪录片中我们可以清楚看到,近年来阿富汗的安全和贫穷问题是越加恶化了。但你认为阿富汗人变了吗?还是和以前一样有韧性吗

KF: The worst was the hopelessness, especially among men. Many times it felt that women were braver. Many of them continue studying, even if they know that the society won’t let them in, when it comes to time to actually work.

The young men I talked with wanted to leave the country, they didn't see any future for themselves. The elders keep living with the corrupt system and the so called “leaders” and [believe] foreigners only come to Afghanistan to serve their own interests. This lack of trust and disappointment has grown every time I returned. When I was there in 2008, Kabul was safe and we even traveled with a car on roads, whereas today it is totally impossible to travel. Now, even Kabul has become very unsafe. For me as a journalist it means it is more difficult to gain the trust of those I interview, to get close and to understand them. The good thing is that I see how the young generation which got the chance to get an education has really done well. One can find hope there, especially among young women, even though they are fighting two wars — one a physical war, with poverty and the insecurity, the other in terms of their own society, family, tradition, culture…

KF:最糟的就是失去希望,[这点]在男人中尤为明显。很多时候,感觉上女人要勇敢得多。很多女人都继续求学,即便他们知道,在实际要就业的时候,社会不会给他们机会。

我访问到的青年男子都想要离开阿富汗,他们看不到自己的未来。老一辈的人,则是继续容忍腐败的体制以及所谓的「领袖们」,[相信]外国人来到阿富汗都只是为了自己的利益。每次回去,这种不信任与失望的感觉都越来越强。 2008 年我在那里的时候,喀布尔很安全,我们甚至能开车去旅行,但现在要旅行是完全不可能了。现在即便是喀布尔,都已经变得很不安全。作为记者,这表示要得到被访者的信任、去贴近他们、了解他们,变得更困难了。但我也看到好的一面:有机会受教育的年轻一代,都做得很不错。那里还是有希望的,特别是年轻女性,虽然说他们要面对的是双重的战争── 一个是关于贫穷与安全问题、实实在在的战争,另一个则是关于社会、家庭、传统、文化⋯⋯等方面的战争。

「心之所向」 截图(由 Khazar Fatemi 上传至 Vimeo 的版本)

NB:身为女性,在拍摄这部纪录片的过程中,你是否曾感受到敌意?

KF: I haven’t noticed this so much, because they still treated me as a foreigner. But I can say that taking a walk around the neighborhood, going to the bazaar by myself, even if I almost managed to fit into the crowd, it would still have been much easier if I was a man. I have also noticed that women didn’t feel comfortable to be interviewed in front of the camera. […] Attitudes about women have only grown harder. I think I got away with that, because I am regarded as a foreigner.

KF:我没怎么感受到敌意,因为他们还是当我是外国人。不过我可以说,即便我几乎成功地融入到群众之中,能够自己在邻里间走动、上市场,但如果我是男人,那还是会容易许多。我也注意到,女性在摄影机前受访会感到不自在。 [⋯⋯]对待女性的态度,是越来越恶劣了。我想他们之所以没那样对待我,是因为他们觉得我是外国人。

NB:你也想念伊朗吗?你对那里的社会现状印象如何?

KF: No, I don’t have any nostalgia feeling, but would love to go back one day.

KF:不,我不想念伊朗,但很希望有天能回去。

NB:兰德公司(RAND corporation)[译注:美国智库]研究员 Cheryl Benard 说,来自阿富汗的年轻人──不是老一辈的阿富汗人或来自其他国家的年轻人──移居欧洲后,特别难以融入[当地]社会。这样说公平吗?

KF: I don’t know about such a phenomenon, What I know from studies made here in Sweden is that Afghans are doing very well. They learn Swedish much faster than other groups. Of course when maybe 80% of the youth that come here [from other countries] are from Afghanistan, [it is no surprise] that when crimes are committed by migrants, most of them turn out to be from Afghanistan. But as I mentioned, we are talking about people who value education and have managed to learn the language and integrate into society faster than other groups, as one study I know has shown.

KF:我不知道有这样的现象。就我从瑞典这里的研究所了解到的,阿富汗人过得相当不错。比起其他族群,他们学瑞典文要快得多。当然,在可能有八成[外来的]年轻人都来自阿富汗的情况下,如果有移民犯罪,多数的犯罪者都是阿富汗人[就没什么好惊讶的了]。但就像我前面说过的,我们在谈论的是重视教育、不但学会了瑞典话还比别人要更快融入社会的族群──我知道有个研究的结论是这样。

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